[Snake]

It should be changed to "Reduces your DEF bonuses by half." instead of a 100% nullification of bonus DEF.

 Do I even need to explain more than "This also stacks with Rampaging and has the potential to completely nullify both stat investment + class investment because of a single stat effect that is super common and can be mass applied by most Fire-based AoE, such as Explosion, Salamander, etc."

This is not balanced one bit. I'm not also asking to make the stat worthless, but make it less oppressive on people who bet their coins on bonus DEF, please.

[Kazzy]

Its also one of the few things that keeps tanks from spiralling out of control.

Build some stat res and use counterplay avenues. Or find some Salamander Gloves.


Or just play a Salamander to begin with.

[HaTeD]

its as if burn is more balanced in a way compared to poison but both have a race that's immune

too bad i cant do burn combos on sallys tho

in any case, if someone wants to inflict, theyre going to inflict. its easy to reach upwards of 200 status inflict for hexers with very efficient stat investment to begin with while you have to go out of the way for faith and san to get status res. I dont think status res is the best arguement but its still an option i guess. Thogh you're right, it can be circumvented in a few different ways to fight against.

[Snake]

I don't think asking for the current burn effectiveness to be reduced by about half should "work against this so quintessential thing to stop tanks spiralling out of control". Read a bit deeper into what I meant with a grain of el salterino.

- Burn completely nullifies ALL bonus DEF, which comes mainly out of gear and classes which is yet another bunch of investment. This has the potential to remove up to -20 DEF for just existing (which is the global cap for all bonuses).

It doesn't care if it is provident of Momentum investment in combat, or through SP investment, or through equipment investment. It just 'does not care and goes for the total', which is similar as old Vorpal Strike, in terms of potential, with only the fact it affects bonuses as its limiter.

Maybe not by itself, but Burn is not the only effect that reduces DEF in the game.

(Read: Rampaging)

- Building status resistance to counter Burn is not very doable for most builds, due to how skewed Infliction VS Resistance is.

The only things in the game which can actually get status resistance (Priest or Summoner) already have their own ways to ignore it or remove the status effect, so this is more like some ironic, sick joke than anything.

And if everyone has to go play the same classes just because a status effect is doing too much, it'll just make the game shoehorn others into playing this or not playing at all, which kills any diversity we can have.

For short. Explain how can anyone who doesn't have an easy access or use for SAN and FAI to resist something that can even get further boosted by this:



I still wonder why Dev was so afraid when I agreed that "Luck-based inflictions" should actually have RNG involving it. I might be wrong in 99 things, but there's always 1 where I'm immaculately right.

- Salamander's Skin Gloves cannot be crafted and are a random drop, thus making them unreliable for 'balance talks'.

They're simply not a given, nor easily accessible, and by the time you find one you'll have lost multiple fights due to Burn abuse and would've just done what Hated suggested, and 'just be a summoner bro'.

If I could combine that with a Shield and make a 'Salamander's Shield' I wouldn't be whining here now, would I?

- Just be a Salamandra, just have a Drowned Woman on your pocket, etc.

What if none of those fit my IC and I just wanna be a joe who swings a sword and takes blows for their friends? I don't want play yet another Glykin Grand Summoner/Priest because this is literally what everyone is doing due to disliking being subject to crippling, unfair mechanics such as Burn or Poison. A few months ago we had a huge discussion about it which made Great Reckoning 2 a thing, with the objective to make everyone have some semblance of difference from one person to another.

But that only ended up going backwards because some aspects of the game, which could be toned down, are still at full effect and we're having to 'deal with it or git gud'.

That's retarded.

I'm not asking this to be removed, just toned down a little, even if the right route would be asking "Please, make this work as it should and only affect DEF coming out of active buffs so Burn is not 'Rock Paper Scissors Shotgun', but the counterplay for people who buff abuse".

It's just the lazy way out to balance this. A maximum of -10 DEF for inflicting Burn is still decent enough, just not the -20 DEF absurdity that it can be.

[FaeLenx]

Burn is fine.

[Skullcatrons]

There's multiple debuffs that straight up erases a stat simply because it can.

They would have to be overhauled, and balanced. And most of the time, to actually counter these debuffs require having a gear on, or so goes on.

And it kind of becomes a question of;

"Well if I build FAI and SAN to resist burn.. Then what's the point if a hexer decides to black-bubble me, then burn me and I don't have any way to counter two debuffs that just reduce my FAI to the void, and my DEF to six feet under"

Then you end up having people rolling Glykin or Salamandra so they don't have to worry about debuffs in general for maximum PVP advantages.

[Miller]

I think the main issue with burn is that the counter play isn't really that accessible and the inflicts for burn are all actually already potent skills in their own right.

I think the status should remain as potent but spells like Explosion which ignore evasion AND inflict burn should be toned down if anything. Alternatively, you could give burn a skill like frozen to stop drop and and roll to reduce burn lv by a scaled stat.

[Maksimum_Fire]

I agree pretty firmly with Miller here. A status being effective isn't definitively the problem, so much as its accessibility, and the accessibility of its counterplay. I think Silence is a pretty clear indicator of this; back when Nightflower inflicted silence, and Sonic Shell had a much more accessible silence, it played a much more pivotal role as a status.

How about giving tanks an option in the form of a craftable, consumable item to counter burn? Like throatopeners for Silence. It could cure your burn, and if you have the Perfect talent, give you 0.5*ranks(rounded down) rounds of burn immunity; so 1 to 2 rounds.

This would make burn require preparation and presence of mind to counter, but still make the counterplay pretty widely accessible.

Postnote: I'm not sure whether it should take up an entire slot per item, or have more of a blue potion status, right now. Worth considering it both ways.

[InsainArcaneBirdbrain]

Honestly? I'd like to see all the status curing items (anti-tox, throat opener, etc) all grant immunity based on some degree of perfect talent. It would make having those specific items worth the slot on belt if you particularly struggle against a status, but not without a cost (item slot for a specific status counterplay). Also +1 for a burn cure item. The status is fine as is, just a bit too readily available on already highly potent attacks.

[Trexmaster]

The only thing that bothers me about Burn is the fact that its potency is barely tied to its level.

A LVL 1 Burn is just as effective as a LVL 30+ Burn in removing bonus DEF, the increase in DoT is negligible.

I'd like to see Burn changed to be something like LVL/4 reduced Armor rather than deleting all bonus DEF regardless of what level the status is. If its desired to have Burn still be equally effective at punching through Phys Def% then it could also reduce Phys Def by an equal % to the reduced Armor, at that point higher level burns such as Underworld Flame (LVL 40 at Rank 5) would be the equivalent of Acid Rain (-10% Phys DEF) but with the additional effect of lowering Armor effectiveness in exchange for not impacting Mag Def at all.

In regards to Hellflame Uorate, this change could alter Hellflame Uorate to cause Burn to impact Magic Armor and Mag Def as well, which are a whole lot more common than sources of bonus RES.

I do agree that in general, anything you spend 3m on to cure a status should provide at least a 2 round immunity to the status to avoid getting endlessly caught in a loop of dedicating momentum entirely on a status cure that gets overwritten as well as damaging you for the same cost.