[Rendar]

The armor itself is getting nerfed. Only reason people use it is because of its passive effect, which trumps EVERY piece of heavy armor out that. Hell, even mages where it because its passive effect is so outrageous.

[Daisuke]

It's getting less stats and a worse passive?
I meant armor itself as in the def, magic def, weight, etc.
So how about tuning the armor stats (magic def especially) and changing the passive so it doubles the stats on the armor when you're under a certain % of hp?
Now it doesn't flat out cut everything in half and you get to choose how effective it becomes.
Guns rip through it but they already did anyway. When you're cutting 35 on-hit damage in half, you're most likely dead before it matters.

[Chaos]

Rendar » Mon Nov 17, 2014 3:11 pm[/url]"]Hell, even mages where it because its passive effect is so outrageous.

Why aren't mages getting penalties for casting in Heavy Armor again?

Anyways, I think the effect is fine, but I'd say to give it a penalty as a balance; for instance, give Bodyguard an additional effect that penalizes the user's damage output.

[Ryu-Kazuki]

Chaos » Mon Nov 17, 2014 7:36 pm[/url]"]

Rendar » Mon Nov 17, 2014 3:11 pm[/url]"]Hell, even mages where it because its passive effect is so outrageous.

Why aren't mages getting penalties for casting in Heavy Armor again?

Anyways, I think the effect is fine, but I'd say to give it a penalty as a balance; for instance, give Bodyguard an additional effect that penalizes the user's damage output.

Mages can't get their spell damage bonuses while wearing heavy armor, technically that is a penalty in itself.

And no, that'd make no one wear the armor if you had penalized damage output. It'd go from pro to no fo sho.

[Ranylyn]

I honestly don't see the issue. Over half your current health? So, it turns being dead in 1-2 hits into being dead in 2-3? Whoopdy freaking do, you're still going to die faster than you can actually do anything about it. Maybe if healing effects weren't so easily outdamaged, I would agree that this needs a tweak. However, even one on one in PVE, it can be impossible to outheal monsters if you spam heals twice per turn. IMO, this just makes PVE healing even a remote semblance of an option, and marginally reduces the risk of a melee character wiping. Epecially since evokers really want Arcane Tattoo for long dungeons.

As for PVP, I'd argue the other armor effects can very much be worth it. But rather than give examples that will make people rage and scream "no u" at me, I will instead propose another alternatives on how to better balance heavy armor in general.


- As the bodyguard is, if I recall correctly, the heaviest armor in the game, might I propose some kind of weight based penalty weighed against your strength? A penalty to defensive stats per point the weight exceeds your total strength. 10 strength too few? +10 damage taken. As such, if you don't have the strength to wear the thing efficiently, you can't correctly adapt to enemy attack to angle yourself better so the blows glance off it, taking heavier direct blows. As only very high str characters would be able to wear the bodyguard, this would help discourage people from taking bonus damage. Meanwhile, this would prevent much nerfing of light armors, while guaranteeing that only actual tanks wear heavy. This would also give Galdric armors an actual use rather than simply being discarded for lower defense.

- Likewise, weighing Strength against weight for terms of calculating the actual weight. For example, a Light Armor might have 10 weight and 5 evade, which is a net evade penalty. I propose that every 3 strength negates the armor's weight penalty against evasion by 1. This would make more medium weight armors actually viable for more of a "I CAN dodge, but I CAN take a hit" setup rather than being forced into one camp or another. They'll never be as good a dodger as an unarmored character or as tanky as a heavy, but that's exactly the point. Right now the only real benefit is the extra effects like resists to one element, which are situational.

- To balance the two points above, raise the raw defense modifiers on heavy armor a bit, without touching their weight. With these ideas, heavy armor would be like a reward for passing a certain strength threshold, and not be rendered obsolete by light armors.


Just some random brain farts brought upon by the migrane I happen to have at this exact moment. Maybe I can explain better once I get some painkillers in me.

[Rendar]

Ryu-Kazuki » Mon Nov 17, 2014 6:40 pm[/url]"]

Chaos » Mon Nov 17, 2014 7:36 pm[/url]"]

Rendar » Mon Nov 17, 2014 3:11 pm[/url]"]Hell, even mages where it because its passive effect is so outrageous.

Why aren't mages getting penalties for casting in Heavy Armor again?

Anyways, I think the effect is fine, but I'd say to give it a penalty as a balance; for instance, give Bodyguard an additional effect that penalizes the user's damage output.

Mages can't get their spell damage bonuses while wearing heavy armor, technically that is a penalty in itself.

And no, that'd make no one wear the armor if you had penalized damage output. It'd go from pro to no fo sho.

Just going to point out that not getting your CLASS BONUS THAT YOU PAY FOR AND GET EXTRA POINTS FOR WEARING UNARMORED SHIT, which is like. +10 spell power mind you. Isn't actually penalty. You're just not getting your bonus. You're not getting a 25-40% FP cost redux on your first EVOKER spell either. You do however, now take half damage from something that does over half your current HP. Which is a lot.

I kind of liked the idea of "PLAYERS GET BAD DODGE FOR WEARING THIS" butttt you already took that anyways. Change it so that you have a 'fatigue' meter, like in DA:O. You don't have enough strength to wear this shit? Sucks for you. Your shit costs a lot more to cast. This would be offset by strength, of course. < Or if battlemages get added, their will stat or something akin to that. >

That, or just cause people who are casting in armor that weighs to much for them to have a like. 90% spell cast failure rate. That'd teach them.

In all seriousness, X number of uses before it wears out sounds nice. Or forcing them to protect allies around them for it to kick in < Wherein it gives you the PROTECT ability >