[Autumn]

This thread is meant to be a list of common double turning scenarios still left in the game that can be exploited very reliably to catch players with, since double turning is so potent, you'll rarely find an instance where someone is in the perfect position to not be punished by a double turn somehow, even with godlike positioning.

The Round Robin system was implemented in order to prevent teams from synergizing too well together in order to systematically rip open other team's key members too quickly, it also removed the old system's double turning through changing your initiative mid battle very handily so that was a welcome change for at least that reason.

Methods in the game that can still give you reliable double turns:

The most common one you'll find is in teamfights primarily, where in if your team goes first, and your team kills an enemy team member, they are taken out of the turn order and everyone on the enemy team is shunted up 1 place forward. This results in the slower members of the enemy team now going ahead of the previously faster members of your team, it all shifts by one position and can get your dodgies murdered very easily by someone they were previously faster than.

This causes specific people to double turn other people, and this can be planned around for a knowing player, if your teammate is about to die you may be able to threaten an enemy team member with a double turn from either you or an ally if you set up for them, which in this game can just mean death very quickly if you consider that some builds (such as twin dance electric axes or fists) deal obscene amounts of damage for the trade off of having less effective range than others do.

This makes it so that the team that catches people out and kills an enemy team member first gets punished for their mistake, and leaving them alive just so that this doesn't happen isn't a valid play if you consider that healing is very burst heavy, and healers are eagerly awaiting the moment to full heal an ally up from near-death.

Possible solutions of how to fix this might include:
-Fixed turn orders determined at the start of battle, these positions do not change.
-The team that moves first will never shift position (For example, if blue moved first, blue will ALWAYS move first, but the positions of players can still change depending if a member of blue team dies)
-Removing Round Robin (Not my choice but I feel the need to include the option)

The next most common double turning method has to do with summons primarily.

Now I'm not 100% sure why this occurs but I have to guess its that summons are placed specially within the turn order to always appear at the end of their team's bracket, which means that when there is none of their team left, it reads out that the enemy player is still the last person to have taken their turn. 

And so it moves your team's bracket to be ahead of them, given that the summons always move after their team however the summons get to have 2 rounds in a row where they're allowed to wail down on the remaining players, this means death from summons like the Railgan, Suzaku or Wolf Companion who have a lot of damage they can dish out that is very position dependent.

If there's something like 3 summons on the board, that's 42 momentum worth of damage you have to tank all at once, even from the lower DPS output of summons that's a lot of damage, and it feels very cheap and frustrating for it to occur.

There is also the chance that this results in your enemy opponent you just downed die harding, and taking their turn immediately after along with all their summons, which is even more frustrating when it happens.

Possible solutions to fix this might include:
-Summons always taking their turn after all players have gone, no matter what.
-Summons unsummoning themselves one round after the owner's death (this is a nerf/buff, summoners would no longer bleed out FP after death but they'd no longer have minions to carry out their job afterwards.)

The last method of double turning I want to discuss is between players with the same initiative, and I will not blame you if there's nothing that can be done about this one, but it uses one of the solutions from above to fix it.

When players have the same initiative they'll often be jumbled around in the turn order very randomly, this can range from being minorly annoying to being complete and utter chaos.

To put one instance off the top of my head into perspective, 4 base Celerity is the most common base CEL value in the game, 16 out of the 48 playable races in the game (a whopping 33%) have this amount. Myself and three others on the same team ran into an issue where our turn order as a team was completely shuffled, now this was actually really bad for the enemy team when you consider that there is a DH and an Arbalest who could just very randomly get their full combo off on someone cause they rolled into a good position that turn.

This was also incredibly hard to just plan around so don't think it was completely free either.

Possible solutions of how to fix this might include:
-Fixed turn orders determined at the start of battle, these positions do not change.
-The team that moves first will never shift position (For example, if blue moved first, blue will ALWAYS move first, but the positions of players can still change depending if a member of blue team dies)

If anyone has any other reliable methods of double turning other players I'd be grateful to hear it, but I think I got the main three instances of this occurring.

Additionally if my walls of text are hard to understand I'll make a visual guide about what I mean.