![]() |
Class Balancing: Martial Artist - Printable Version +- NEUS Projects (https://neus-projects.net/forums) +-- Forum: Sigrogana Legend 2 (OOC) (https://neus-projects.net/forums/forumdisplay.php?fid=8) +--- Forum: Balance Fu (https://neus-projects.net/forums/forumdisplay.php?fid=11) +--- Thread: Class Balancing: Martial Artist (/showthread.php?tid=2258) Pages:
1
2
|
Class Balancing: Martial Artist - Kameron8 - 01-20-2016 This is the first thread of many to come that deals with rebalancing classes in the game. I have discussed these ideas with several people, and these threads are the things we all agreed on. To make discussion easier and less cluttered, I have separated the suggestions based on base class. To start off, here is Martial Artist. 1. Light Tomahawk's Urawaza bonus no longer has a chance to stun. It now has rank * 20% chance to guard break. Guard break skills now deal full damage when striking guarding opponents. Justification: 2. Shukichi is now consumed after moving or using an attack that teleports you with its effect. To clarify, this removes the ability to Shukichi, move three quarters of the map, then cross the final one quarter of the map with a teleporting attack. Justification: 3. Kip up now reduces the momentum cost of recovering from Knockdown for Light Armor by 0/1/2. Kip up no longer functions with Heavy Armor. Justification: Re: Class Balancing: Martial Artist - Rendar - 01-20-2016 OH ARE WE DOING THIS NOW? OKAY. Well let's get to Martial Artist. At it's core, MA was a good class already pre-update. However whenever the update hit, it was admittedly broken. Even post-nerf, it's still one of the best classes in the game. Whether for dodgers, or otherwise. +20 Evade, +20 Hit, 10% DR, the ability to practically ignore the penalties of KD, +40 Evade against bows. Those are just from innates ALONE that make this class leagues and miles above certain other classes that are forced to take active buffs to even compete with it. It isn't until you get to it's other skills that it truly starts getting broken though. Geldoren Light Tomahawk Heaven's Kick Peddling Wheel Meditate Shukuchi Cleanse Body Phoenix Talon Crane hop It sadly, doesn't stop their. Both of MA's promotion classes benefit greatly from this. Monk building on to the tanky-ness that is MA, as well as giving options to further lower enemies Hit against you, KnockDown Options, Body of Isesip (in case you felt like cheesing one-hit wonders more), +CRIT for fists... Monk gets all of that. Whilst Verglas gets the benefits of Phoenix Talon and Crane Hop being cheap ways to get your opponent airborne (and generally ignore the need to build STR to get you/opponent airborne.) Verglas also can (and generally does) cover up the weakness of being a main class MA by giving it the ability to use a shield and stack DR to high heaven. A lot of the issues with MA could be solved if Shukuchi gets the nerf it deserves, whilst also having Meditate taking a hit to it's ability to be broken is also a good nerf. Those alone will make the base class be put back in line with actual base classes. Right now, MA alone can contend with Promo classes, and that really shouldn't be a thing. Also. I pretty much agree to the above changes, even if 1 is still too strong for a base-class skill. Guard Breaking 100% of the time isn't really good either, considering MA's promo classes both have very reliable (and cheap) methods of KD now. If we're going to apply armor effects, since no one that I know of really used heavy armor with MA, then apply it to Crane hop as well. Making its range smaller the heavier you are wearing. 4 > 2 > Unusable. Re: Class Balancing: Martial Artist - Autumn - 01-20-2016 Regarding the OP's points for now, I'll agree with all three of those, please make this happen. Re: Class Balancing: Martial Artist - Soapy - 01-20-2016 Everything in the OP sounds good to me. Re: Class Balancing: Martial Artist - Ranylyn - 01-20-2016 On Sderg's points, I'm in favor of making evasion bad while meditating. I mean, how do you dodge while focused so intently. Also, agreement with the OP. Re: Class Balancing: Martial Artist - Shujin - 01-20-2016 I personally find meditate pretty situational as it is already... There are far worse healing tricks out there that can even be spammed more than this for 3M. But yeah OP´s post seems to be nice. If alone for no Kip-up with heavy armor, cause thats a dick move. Re: Class Balancing: Martial Artist - Chaos - 01-21-2016 #1: At first, I thought Light Tomahawk was a bit too cheap to be true. Then I actually put it to the test, and realized that the stun effect was quite inconsistent, and it often occurred when I didn't need it. If it's somehow able to consistently stun someone turn after turn, then provide Stun Immunity once the infliction expires. #2: The only reason I would nerf this skill is to prevent people from running away after striking. If we're talking just people being able to chase down folks that just run from everything inconvenient, then let's keep Shukichi as it is. #3: A completely necessary nerf. Re: Class Balancing: Martial Artist - Autumn - 01-21-2016 I will disagree with light tomahawk there Chaos, there is absolutely no reason a base class skill for 3m should have a chance of insta-winning you the match, this has happened to me a few times before even. Re: Class Balancing: Martial Artist - Trexmaster - 01-21-2016 Quote: At first, I thought Light Tomahawk was a bit too cheap to be true. Then I actually put it to the test, and realized that the stun effect was quite inconsistent, and it often occurred when I didn't need it. If it's somehow able to consistently stun someone turn after turn, then provide Stun Immunity once the infliction expires. It's not because it can get chain-stuns that makes it broken, it's the fact it -can stun- that is, on top of dealing decent damage for every attempt you make to win the fight. If it -does- proc, you get a free turn on the enemy. Which is typically enough to cost them the match. Combo that into being able to fly across the map 23 (or 15 if #2 happens) spaces and throw down LT, it's pretty hard to avoid suffering from this. Keep in mind the only other methods of stun in the game are 1. Blowback Cannon (which requires you to hit) 2. Skullcaver (that requires you to hit and crit the target, and has a -lower- chance (albeit only by 1%) to proc.) and 3. Flipping someone onto/blowing a rock, which don't always spawn and rarely allow you to setup for. Re: Class Balancing: Martial Artist - Kameron8 - 01-21-2016 "[url=http://neus-projects.net/viewtopic.php?p=11732#p11732 Wrote:Chaos » Thu Jan 21, 2016 2:22 am[/url]"]#1: At first, I thought Light Tomahawk was a bit too cheap to be true. Then I actually put it to the test, and realized that the stun effect was quite inconsistent, and it often occurred when I didn't need it. If it's somehow able to consistently stun someone turn after turn, then provide Stun Immunity once the infliction expires. I (obviously) agree with the people above me. Stun is detrimental, and just because you may not have a build that crushes someone immediately after stunning them, doesn't mean this skill doesn't do that extremely often. (When it goes off, not because it stuns often) As far as Shukichi, it's not really about preventing Martial Artists from pursuing someone who runs from inconveniences. They can already do that without ANY trouble. The reason this change has been suggested is because they can cross the entire map and hit you in one turn. Fighting as an archer, a mage, or anyone who just wants to buff is a huge struggle against someone who teleports on over and crits you for a 100+ damage Geldoren straight from round 0. No other class can even come close to doing that. |